Weird Doubleplay

[crashtest]

From our write-up:

"I caught the foul ball, heard rumblings, semi-screaming from our dugout, looked over and saw Lance jumping up and down and saw Lance waving his arms and realized that Mark Sweeney wasn't getting back," Ausmus said. "I threw it over there for a forceout."

From the Dodger write-up:

"With the tying run at the plate and Matt Kemp, who homered earlier in the game, on deck, Sweeney took off towards second base with one out on a pop fly behind the plate by Juan Pierre and was forced out at first, ending the game as the Dodgers dropped their fourth consecutive contest, 7-4, against the Astros at Dodger Stadium".

You know, the Eskimos have about a dozen words for "snow". Likewise baseball with "out". There's strikeout, groundout, pop-out, fly-out, line-out, out by infield fly rule, out by interference, caught stealing, pick-off, out by running out of the baseline, out by passing preceding runner, out by batting out of order, force out and"doubled-off" which is technically out by appeal. The whole point of Sweeny's boner is that he was not FORCED to go anywhere. It was a foul ball. If fair, it would have been an infield fly. Technically, the umps are required to say, "Infield fly, if fair".

Rule 2.00:An INFIELD FLY is a fair fly ball (not including a line drive nor an attempted bunt) which can be caught by an infielder with ordinary effort, when first and second, or first, second and third bases are occupied, before two are out. The pitcher, catcher and any outfielder who stations himself in the infield on the play shall be considered infielders for the purpose of this rule.
When it seems apparent that a batted ball will be an Infield Fly, the umpire shall immediately declare “Infield Fly” for the benefit of the runners. If the ball is near the baselines, the umpire shall declare “Infield Fly, if Fair.”The ball is alive and runners may advance at the risk of the ball being caught, or retouch and advance after the ball is touched, the same as on any fly ball. If the hit becomes a foul ball, it is treated the same as any foul.
If a declared Infield Fly is allowed to fall untouched to the ground, and bounces foul before passing first or third base, it is a foul ball. If a declared Infield Fly falls untouched to the ground outside the baseline, and bounces fair before passing first or third base, it is an Infield Fly.

It is conceivable that the Dodgers could have filed a protest if the umps didn't say "Infield fly, if fair" for the benefit of the runners. The ball wasn't all that foul - indeed, I have seen games at Candlestick and Wrigley where such a pop-up was blown back into fair territory. I have seen catchers miss such pop-ups and it is conceivable that it could have landed untouched and, hitting the edge of the cut-out, bounced back into fair territory. In that case, the runners needed to have the benefit of an "Infield fly, if fair" announcement.

At any rate, both Ausmus and the Dodger writer got it wrong. Sweeney was not "forced out". In the proper parlance, he was "doubled-off".

[crashtest]

A FORCE PLAY is a play in which a runner legally loses his right to occupy a base by reason of the batter becoming a runner.

Sweney never lost his right to occupy first base, hence it was not a "force play".

[crashtest]

Rule 7.08(d) He fails to retouch his base after a fair or foul ball is legally caught before he, or his base, is tagged by a fielder. He shall not be called out for failure to retouch his base after the first following pitch, or any play or attempted play. This is an appeal play;

Let's say there were no outs and both runners were "breaking" with the pitch and the runner on second is near third and Sweeney is near second when Ausmus catches the ball. Ausmus fires to first to "double-off" Sweeney. THIS IS AN APPEAL PLAY. An appeal play is A PLAY and, by this rule, A PLAY removes the possibilty of an appeal at second on the runner now standing on third. Technically, this is precisely what the rule says.

Most UNASSISTED TRIPLE PLAYS are like this EXCEPT, the runner going from first to second is TAGGED OUT OFF BASE after the SS "appeals" the runner going to third by stepping on the base. According to this rule, the runner coming from first WOULD NOT BE OUT if he was standing on second when he was tagged* and the SS could not then throw to first for an appeal (since there was already "a play" made at second). Now, let's say the SS catches the line drive and then tags the runner from first now standing on second. Said runner is OUT ON APPEAL even if he is in possession of second base. Technically, the SS cannot now step on second to "double-off" the runner going to third. HOWEVER, if the SS throws to 3B and the runner is TAGGED out before he reaches possession of third base, said runner is OUT. However, if he is standing on third, he cannot be "tagged out".

OK, what is the point of this mental mastubation? It explains the ruling in the 1980 NLCS. A hump-back liner is caught/trapped by Vern Ruhle who then throws to Howe for (an appeal) which "doubles off" the runner. Howe then runs down to second to make an appeal to "triple off" Maddox who now has possession of third. The umps had a long discussion and said there were 2 outs and Maddox could stay on third. This was precisely the correct ruling since the play at first negated the possibility of another appeal play at second.

The Rules Committee might need to revisit this. OK, what are the Eskimo words for "snow"?

*Meaning, if the SS FIRST stepped on second and THEN tagged the runner standing on second.

[crashtest]

Take a more likely scenario: Runners on 1st and 2nd, no outs. Left handed pitcher is on the mound in the stretch position. Runners break with the pitch. Batter lines back to the pitcher toward the third base side of the mound. Pitcher catches the liner with his back to first, but he clearly sees the runner well off second. He fires to second to double off the runner on appeal. Runner who was on first is now scrambling back to the bag. SS now fires to first to try to "triple off" the runner on appeal. This IS NOT A FORCE PLAY, nor can ANOTHER APPEAL be made. The first baseman should be instructed to handle it as a TAG PLAY. It might be worthwhile to go over this once or twice in Spring Training. Like Joaquin said, juneberno. Likewise, runners should be instructed to go stand on second, or at least avoid the tag at first base

[jamesa46]

crashtest said:

Rule 7.08(d) He fails to retouch his base after a fair or foul ball is legally caught before he, or his base, is tagged by a fielder. He shall not be called out for failure to retouch his base after the first following pitch, or any play or attempted play. This is an appeal play;

Let's say there were no outs and both runners were "breaking" with the pitch and the runner on second is near third and Sweeney is near second when Ausmus catches the ball. Ausmus fires to first to "double-off" Sweeney. THIS IS AN APPEAL PLAY. An appeal play is A PLAY and, by this rule, A PLAY removes the possibilty of an appeal at second on the runner now standing on third. Technically, this is precisely what the rule says.

Most UNASSISTED TRIPLE PLAYS are like this EXCEPT, the runner going from first to second is TAGGED OUT OFF BASE after the SS "appeals" the runner going to third by stepping on the base. According to this rule, the runner coming from first WOULD NOT BE OUT if he was standing on second when he was tagged* and the SS could not then throw to first for an appeal (since there was already "a play" made at second). Now, let's say the SS catches the line drive and then tags the runner from first now standing on second. Said runner is OUT ON APPEAL even if he is in possession of second base. Technically, the SS cannot now step on second to "double-off" the runner going to third. HOWEVER, if the SS throws to 3B and the runner is TAGGED out before he reaches possession of third base, said runner is OUT. However, if he is standing on third, he cannot be "tagged out".

OK, what is the point of this mental mastubation? It explains the ruling in the 1980 NLCS. A hump-back liner is caught/trapped by Vern Ruhle who then throws to Howe for (an appeal) which "doubles off" the runner. Howe then runs down to second to make an appeal to "triple off" Maddox who now has possession of third. The umps had a long discussion and said there were 2 outs and Maddox could stay on third. This was precisely the correct ruling since the play at first negated the possibility of another appeal play at second.

The Rules Committee might need to revisit this. OK, what are the Eskimo words for "snow"?

*Meaning, if the SS FIRST stepped on second and THEN tagged the runner standing on second.

My understanding was that the umpires had ruled that Vern Ruhle had trapped the ball and not caught it. I don't recall the sequence of events. Was Howe playing first that evening or third?

If Ruhle caught the ball, my understanding is all runners must tag up before advancing and since neither of the two baserunners had returned to the base to tag up a triple play had ensued.

My question is if the umpires ruled that he trapped the ball, how did they rule a double play?
I never found out exactly what the ruling was. I assumed that the ruling was that it was a trapped ball and not caught by Ruhle.

[crashtest]

James, here is the history from AstrosDaily, but they didn't get it entirely right. I thought it was Maddox who ended up on third, but it was Bake McBride -- I just remembered it was a black outfielder with an Afro; it was Maddox who hit the soft liner to Ruhle.

QUOTE:In the 4th inning with two Phillies on base, Garry Maddox hit a soft come-backer to the pitcher Vern Ruhle. He grabbed the ball and lobbed a throw to first baseman Art Howe. Home plate umpire Doug Harvey called it a trapped ball but the umpires at first and third base said "no, Ruhle caught the ball on the fly." Following the putout at first, which was a double play, Howe ran to second to complete a triple play. The Phillies screamed in disbelief. The six umpires huddled and then Harvey conferred with League President Chub Feeney. The twenty-minute argument resulted with no triple play, just a double play. Since time had been called before Howe tagged Bake McBride, Harvey disallowed that out at second base. Both teams protested the game.

CLOSE QUOTE

Actually, Harvey didn't make any call because the batter-runner Maddox screened his view. Secondly, Howe was indeed at first. He took the throw from Ruhle. I was at the game and I remember Howe looking at the first base ump and the body language of both indicated that Howe asked, "Who is out?" The ump put up an out sign twice to indicate that Maddox was out by Ruhle's "catch" and the runner who had been at first was "doubled-up". Howe then trotted down to second where he appealed to "triple-up" McBride who by this time was standing on third, never having tagged up. The ump at 2nd gave a vigorous out sign to indicate that he too thought Ruhle had caught the soft liner and that McBride was out. Howe then pumped his fist and threw the ball down and the rest of the Astros ran with him to the dugout. A 20 minute conference ensued with the umps and Chub upon which they ruled 2 were out and McBride could stay on third. The Astros were reluctant to return to the field and I still have the vision of Joe Morgan being the first one back on the field and him waving the other guys to hustle back out on the field to re-seize the momentum and shut the Phillies down with no runs scored, which they did. "Time being called" could be a way of saying that the appeal on McBride was disallowed because a "play", ie the appeal play from Ruhle to Howe at first, negated the possibility of another appeal at second per my discussiin above: "He shall not be called out for failure to retouch his base after the first following pitch, or any play or attempted play. This is an appeal play;