Canadian Health Care System bcwywfyjmgi

[crashtest]

news.aol.com/story/_a/mom-delivers-rare-identical-quadruplets/20070816203609990001?ncid=NWS00010000000001


The Jepps drove 325 miles to Great Falls for the births because hospitals in Calgary were at capacity, Key said.

"The difficulty is that Calgary continues to grow at such a rapid rate. ... The population has increased a lot faster than the number of hospital beds," he said.


Wonderful. Where are Hillary and John Edwards to decry the pitiful state of health care in Canada - which system they want to impose on us?

Calgary has a pop of slightly more than a million -- Great Falls, Mt 56,000. Yet there was not a single bed within 300 miles in Canada to handle this extremely high risk delivery. Can you imagine riding 8 eight hours in a car, pregnant with quadruplets in need of delivery? Where is the hue and cry about how sh!tty the Canadian Health Care System is that they do this to the most vulnerable of their citizens. Truth be told, the family was better off even if they had 4 neonatal beds available in Calgary. Imagine the expense of maintaining 4 neonatal beds in an outback town of 50,000.

[texiban001]

"Blame Canada, Blame Canada! With their beady little eyes and their flapping little heads. It's not even a real country anyway!"

I have not met too many Canuck's that really liked it up there. That's why they are here! ;D

[officerrabb]

universal health care is still a great idea, but somebody needs to come up with a much better plan for it than we currently have at our disposal

[texiban001]

Not saying that Universal Health Care isn't needed. Just not Canada's version.

My wife had a horseback riding accident about a month ago and broke her right arm and 3 ribs and had to get 12 staples put in her head.

Emergency Room - $7,400.00 FOR 56 X-RAYS, 12 STAPLES, PAIN MEDICATION AND RUDE NURSES!!!
Orthopedic Surgeon - $1,750.00 - GREAT DOCTOR!!! (If you ever need an orthopedic surgeon and you are in the Livingston area, IM me and I will tell you who it is.)
Hospital - $24,825.00 FOR SURGERY AND OVERNIGHT STAY!!!
Anesthiesiologist - $1,235.00

[chandler44]

Is your wife ok now?

[crashtest]

texiban,

So it looks like the entire bill came to about $35,000 - of which the ONE PERSON who actually FIXED the problem got about 5%. But look at it this way, $35,000 wouldn't buy you a three pitch strikeout from Roger Clemens. And Clemens gets about 5 times as much as for ONE PITCH as the ortho got for patching up your bride. I, too, hope all is well. I'm glad your surgeon pleased you - it's good to hear some of us are doing something right.

[crashtest]

BTW, let's have a Universal Baseball League where all tickets and concessions are free, and all the players get no more than $100,000 with the proviso that they can be sued for malpractice if they make an error or give up a game-tying HR in the 9th.

[crashtest]

texiban,

To understand the complexities of the issue of health care, you have to look at three things. 1) What it COSTS to provide a service. 2) What is CHARGED for the service provided. 3) What REVENUE can be expected from having provided the service. The difference between 1) and 3) is traditionally called PROFIT. Profit is generally considered a GOOD thing in America, considered part and parcel of a free market democracy. In medicine, it is generally looked upon as GREED.

If you were an illegal immigrant couple, exactly the same services would have been rendered as mandated by EMTALA law. The revenue to the provider would likely have been ZERO. The illegal immigrant couple is not mandated to be provided food, shelter, clothing,a job, income, transportation. The only things mandated are 1) due process of law, 2) ad lib access to emergency medical care and 3) free public school education for their children. Bottom line for the health care provider - RED INK, and lots of it.

If you are 65 or older, then you are eligible for Medicare. The revenue paid to the hospital is a lump sum "DRG". It doesn't matter whether there are complications or prolonged lengths of stay - the payment is the same. The bottom line is that the COST of the service is barely covered by the REVENUE.

If you are poor and on Medicaid, you pay NOTHING for the service and Medicaid pays a REVENUE that is seldom more than 50% of COST. Bottom line - more RED INK.

If you are covered by a "managed care" health insurance product, then the health insurance company negotiates fixed rates, which REVENUEoften barely covers cost.

If you are covered by "traditional" health insurance that pays 80% and then 100% after a certain amount, then the REVENUE is enough to cover cost and provide for a small PROFIT to try to soak up the red ink (see above), but the health insurance company charges a high premium for this coverage, which makes the patient (and their employer) b*tch and moan and seek lower cost alternatives.

If you are one of the 45 million "un-insured", then you will be charged rates that have been calculated that have little relation to COST but mostly concerned with the BOTTOM LINE. CHARGES are jacked up as high as possible so the third-party payor feels good when they get away with paying only 30% or 50% of them and the provider can thus expect enough REVENUE to at least keep the doors open. The self-pay patient will often provide ZERO REVENUE, but if they pay the ENTIRE bill, they are truly getting ripped off. Often they are sued to the point of bankrupcy based on these ludicrous CHARGES.

Trial lawyers see to it that there is very little way to provide cut-rate, cheap care. No bag of beans and rice here, EVERYBODY gets chateaubriand for two -- medium rare if you don't mind and I'll sue you if it is not the perfect shade of pink. Suppliers of drugs and medical equipment aren't hurting in the least -- they are often some of the most PROFITABLE companies traded on the NYSE. The only way for hospitals to reduce COST is thus to reduce the number of personnel and keep the salaries of those they have to an absolute minimum. Hence all the b*tching and moaning about lousy nurses and hospital care. Doctors generally aren't paid by the hospital, their services are re-imbursed separately by the third-party payor. But doctors are forbidden to unionize and "collective negotiation" is a joke. It is simply a "take-it-or-leave-it proposition --- with the proviso that if too many doctors "leave it", they'll be sued for restraint of trade and conspiracy and collusion. Hence the fact that your ortho, the ONE PERSON who actually had the knowledge and skills to fix your wife had a CHARGE that was a mere FIVE PERCENT of the total. To put that into perspective, about 40% of the COST of a drug is marketing, packaging and advertizing.

SOLUTION to our "health care crisis". 1) Immediately reduce the COST to the system by eliminating care provided to illegal immigrants. 2) Develop uniform CHARGES so the idea of being a "self-pay" has some connection with reality. It is easy to spend someone else's money for health care, one usually makes more conscientious use when they have to spend their own money. But one shouldn't have to pay for flagrantly inflated charges. 3) Immediately introduce stringent tort reform to reduce the COST of defensive medicine.

[crashtest]

The astute among you may have noticed that I did not mention reduction in REVENUE to doctors. Tell you what, forgive or repay the loans I had to take to get through medical school and survive the pittance I was paid in residency (no more than $2.50 per hour for 100 hour work weeks. Pay me back pay calculated at merely twice minimum wage with time and a half for overtime and interest accumulated since 1983. Pay my $60,000 per year malpractice premium (some OBs have to pay $100,000 premiums or more in places like Florida and Pennsylvania). Ban $100 MILLION dollars contracts to people who do something as useless as playing a sport. Fixing a broken bone should be worth more than throwing a single pitch in a baseball game. Pay me a mere $20 dollars an hour for the ER call coverage mandated of me so I can be at Maria's beck and call when she decides to come in for a delivery or other OB emergency that she has neither the intent nor ability to pay a reasonable fee for. After those conditions are met, I'll be willing to negotiate a reduction in revenue.

PS, the amounts mentioned above would total approximately $1 million.

[texiban001]

I agree with Crash. It is totally ridicoulous what doctors have to put up with. Maria will not pay nor will any other illegal as they think that they are entitled to free health care.

My wife was thrown from her horse about a month ago. I have the bill. I do not have a problem opaying a "fair" fee to the hospital. I do have a problem paying 20 times the amount something costs to make up for the non-payment of others. Just one example, my wife had to have a titanium rod put in her right arm. This rod is about 7 inches long and 3/8" diameter. Does this sound like it is worth $7,000.00?

That is what I am being charged.

[crashtest]

texiban, I feel for you man. I have been railing against that BS for years. A self-pay patient might be willing to work out an agreement for my fee for emergency care. It is always within the same ratio as you described 5% to 15% of the hospital bill. BUT, when they are hit with the mega-hospital bill they either just give up the ghost or pay what little money they have to the hospital to try to keep the wolves off their back. I'm put on the back burner and never see a dime.

Add up all the drug and IV solution charges. I'll bet they come to at least $8,000. Remember, about $3,000 of that is for PACKAGING and MARKETING. Find out which company made your wife's titanium rod. Then check them out on the NYSE, Look for your ortho on the NYSE ---- I bet he isn't listed. Calculate the company's unconscionable profit margin.

If I were in charge, I would pass a law immediately that would prevent a hospital that takes Medicare and Medicaid (they ALWAYS put in this contingency since hospitals would close without those patients) ..... from charging ANY self-pay patient any more than the LEAST AMOUNT the hospital accepts as payment in full from ANY third party payor (usually that would be Medicaid) That would be a first step to a feasible Universal Health Care Plan.

Then I would have ALL medical charges be UNIVERSAL ---- no special deals for Medicare/Medicaid/managed care. ANY self-pay patient who does not pay their entire bill within 90 days will be required to secure a bank loan from the bank of their choice or else be ASSIGNED one on a "random" basis. ALL BANKS would be required to be ON-CALL (you know, like they do DOCTORS) and the number of black beans in the jar that would put them at risk of "getting the hit" would be proportionate to the bank's size and financial status. Let's spread the wealth (and poverty around) so hospitals and doctors don't get stuck with all of it while the bankers are sunning themselves on a Cayman beach.