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Post by jbarron on Sept 29, 2007 0:31:57 GMT -5
AB, get out your calculator and subtract .277 from .331. If that is isn't a decline, I don't know what is. This guy didn't do squat this year until we were practically eliminated.
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Post by hembo36 on Sept 29, 2007 0:44:19 GMT -5
Thats why you're a moron...he isnt in vlads league and to compare him to pujols is an incredible statement in itself. You absolutely said arod was in a decline..i know for f**king fact you said that...how did he end up this year? berkman is nothing more than a above average ballplayer..Nobody has ever denied the threat he poses at the plate but its not a threat you cant see from many other players..i think if his defense and attitude were betetr than we wouldnt even be having this same conversation
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Post by astrobuddy on Sept 29, 2007 0:51:06 GMT -5
hembo.. where did I say I didnt say Arod was declining ? I did say it. I was obviously wrong. I admit that. Something you refuse to do with Berkman. He is alot better than you give him credit for and a little better than vega gives him credit for.
I also never said he was a great glove man. WITH THE BAT.. he is every bit in Vlads league and that been shown to you though you and Vega refuse to admit it.
His attitude was NEVER a problem. It only is this year because the team stunk and you guys have this need to blame someone.
JB.. thats just to simple and it just isnt. While he hasnt hit that high an average again everything else was rising. Look at his whole stat line, not just his BA. It is silly to just use his BA and say he is in steady decline since 2001. Just freaking silly. Players in steady decline dont finish in the top 5 of MVP voting 4 of 5 years following 2001 when they are in steady decline.
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Post by chandler44 on Sept 29, 2007 2:33:00 GMT -5
Berkman's 2006 season was arguably as good as his 2001 season. His OPS since 2001 has been 1.050, .983, .927, 1.016, .935, 1.041, .898
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Post by vega51 on Sept 29, 2007 7:41:00 GMT -5
Hembo, be prepared for the insults from some people, they can't accept logic.
I remember when i said Cubs will win division, they laughed.
I remember when i said AZ would win division, they laughed and argue against it.
I remember when i said Yankees would make the playoffs, they laughed and argue against it.
I remember when i said astros would finish closer to last than first, they laughed and argue against it.
I remember when i said Burke would finish with better ops than biggio this year, they laughed and argue against it.
Because they are USUALLY wrong, they NEED to get personal and INSULT people, so hembo, james, barron, be prepared toward insults.
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Post by crashtest on Sept 29, 2007 8:29:54 GMT -5
vega, that's a pretty good run .... I've got to tip my cap. There was a time this season when we were doing as well or better than the Cubs and Yankees. This was a division title just ripe for the picking, but we were too interested in sniffing out 3k truffles.
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Post by hembo36 on Sept 29, 2007 8:41:50 GMT -5
Something you refuse to do with Berkman
im not refusing to do so..I dont believe im wrong..berkman isnt that good guys...you can tell yourself whatever you want, but the guy i stick up for(arod) his stats can be proven time and again...chit, you mention berkman and theres a number of players better or comparable to....you have never admitted being wrong until this second...dont hit me with the holier than thou thing because i admit being wrong as well
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Post by astrobuddy on Sept 29, 2007 9:50:38 GMT -5
hembo.. you keep saying that but it just isnt true. LOOK AT THE STATS. There are not many players with the stats he has over his career.
Holier than though??? When I did imply that? I was wrong about Arod. Big deal. INHO you are wrong about Berkman. He has been above average solid for his whole career. He is as dangerous a hitter as Arod or Pujols or Vlad. Hell.. Vlad hasnt hit as many homers in a single season as Berkman. Vlad has never had a top RBI season like Berkman. Vlad and Berkman are very much the same hitter statistically. Vlad gets the nod overall because he plays better defense. I dont dispute that.
Its easy to stick up for a guy with out of this world stats. Like the people that all of a sudden say they are Yankee or Red Sox fans because they won the WS. Its hard to be a fan of the Astros.
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Post by hembo36 on Sept 29, 2007 14:51:07 GMT -5
f**k you c*cksucker...the fck with what you think...it doesnt even matter because you will either still be going down on lance or are too obtuse to actually read...vega did all the legwork and so have i time after time...we have posted the stats and you choose to continue your'show me the stats deal' You're a complete tool and moron...i posted not long ago no fewer than 15 people with better or same stats..you chose to ignore it...It gets old, ab...why would i post something, back it up with stats, only to have you ask me where the stats are? its an ever lasting episode of the twilight zone with you....i dont have the energy for your bs any longer
theres a HUGE difference between random sh*t and a fact based argument...if i say so and so is better im damned sure going to have compared the 2....if im wrong i will admit it and not spin it...i said reggie willits for AL rookie of the year because to the best of my knowledge he was the best...he was for quite a while this year but has fallen off completely and pedroia is a better candidate..anyways
berkman and vlad are comparable in a few categories for sure but overall vlad is much better...the stats are there ab...its not a conspiracy here and this can be readily verified
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Post by chandler44 on Sept 29, 2007 14:55:39 GMT -5
You really don't have any room to talk, considering *I* posted stats that mean more than just avg & HR that showed most of those guys did *NOT* have better or same stats, and you chose to ignore that.
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Post by hembo36 on Sept 29, 2007 15:00:09 GMT -5
of course you did..thats only because you know it all...you certainly do carry a lot of extra weight around with all that random data.
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Post by chandler44 on Sept 29, 2007 15:04:18 GMT -5
Either you can't read well or you choose to be intentionally obtuse to stir up trouble.
Usually when you think another person 'knows it all', it's because you feel inadequate in your own knowledge. Like I've pointed out to you on numerous occasions, I don't know it all, don't pretend to and have never made a claim to (I would, however, put my 'knowledge' up against yours any day of the week and twice on Sunday). I just don't mind spending the extra 5-10 seconds it takes to look up the facts that you're apparently too lazy to do.
What's even funnier is that you call facts 'random data'.
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Post by astrobuddy on Sept 29, 2007 16:06:26 GMT -5
Vega never posted anything. Chandler and I posted the stats. YOu completely refuse to look at them objectively.
You keep going back to this " overall" thing. I never said a word about Berkman being a better defensive player. In fact, just a few posts ago I said Vlad was better overall. I said they are the same HITTER. They are. The stats are there that prove that.
Just like Chandler said... You get mad and start cussing and insulting people when you lose. You have NO facts to back up what you say. Like I said.. You just throw sh*t up against the wall and hope everyone agrees. Like thats just the way it is, regardless of what the true facts are. Berkman is an elite offensive player, PERIOD. He isnt better, he is just in the same conversation.
Of course you dont have the energy.... You are too damned lazy to find out what the truth is and because of that you get throttled on this over and over and over.
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Post by hembo36 on Sept 29, 2007 16:34:25 GMT -5
There ya go chandler... You da man. Or in this case the statman
ab, always good for a laugh...Thanks bro
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Post by astrobuddy on Sept 29, 2007 17:01:59 GMT -5
Here you go again... when you cant win and you have been shown you are wrong you act as if someone else is to blame and you attack the person instead of the message. You move on and ignore the original topic. You will however lie about what the person says later and try and make a joke out of it at the expense of whomever you are attacking. ( ie: Arod vs Ensberg)
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